During this cleaning are you able to drive? Or the car is blocked?

 

You can drive yes, but when you stop and put the car in either N or P, then cleaning process continues. So if its at traffic lights, and you put into N, the car next to you thinks you want a race.

 

Had exactly the same system in my Disco Sport and it’s the reason I moved away from diesel. The modern engines with DPFs cannot handle short runs because the engine does not get hot enough to burn off the carbon in the DPF.

 

I've done 100,000 miles in journeys in VAG diesels over the past ten years, a lot of them being short living in central London, never experienced a single issue. My usual routine of a motorway blast every two weeks seemed to have worked and no silly systems trying to do anything for me.

I don't think this has anything directly to do with the DPF, DPF regen is a different thing and very noisey (my VAG had a DPF regen cycle), according to the Mazda document above, it seems to be 'injector cleaning'. Injector cleaning on a brand new car.

Is it possible to switch off? What can happened then?
Btw, you put into N at traffic lights??

You can turn the car off yes, and when you turn it back on, it goes right back to its cleaning process.

Yes, sometimes. The car makes less noise and vibrations when out of gear, and I am not entirely sure how the gearbox and clutch system works yet (Mazda technicians also unable to tell me), so I don't want to prematurely wear out the clutch.

I owned a CX-5 Diesel for 4 years from new, that was the most annoying problem with the car that i had.
I pretty sure it´s the same for the inline 6 as it is with the 2.2, a diesel is a diesel. The only positive to take away from it is, at least you can see when the car has gone into "cleaning mode", as i could with the CX-5, most other makes don´t show you that.

When my CX-5 was new, it would go into that mode around every 800 miles, after 4 years, 60000 miles (FSSH and loads of software updates regarding that issue) it would do it every 150 miles.
Don´t whatever you do turn the car off when its "cleaning". As soon as my CX-5 went into that mode i took the car for a drive, using manual gears (Higher revving, as the DPF needs heat) and let it do it´s thing for around 10 miles. Annoying; Yes, costly too. Even after doing it as written above (as my dealer told me to do) i had injectors replaced 3 times, turbo sensors twice and the intake manifold was cleaned 3 times, by shot blasting with walnut shells. Over 5k in repairs, although it was all on warranty even after the warranty ran out..... As its a "known problem"

Thanks for this Lee.

I have to turn off the engine when its doing it, I live in a densely populated area and its not practical to go for a drive at certain times due to traffic, work commitments etc. It's like, 'i'll go the Post Office, then have to end up driving around for an hour or sitting annoying my neighbours', what a way to spend £50k.

Mazda never told me this is a 'thing' that I needed to expect.

Its this a permanent feature, it looks like I may have to consider rejecting the car as this is not liveable at all.

 

I owned a CX-5 Diesel for 4 years from new, that was the most annoying problem with the car that i had.
I pretty sure it´s the same for the inline 6 as it is with the 2.2, a diesel is a diesel. The only positive to take away from it is, at least you can see when the car has gone into "cleaning mode", as i could with the CX-5, most other makes don´t show you that.

When my CX-5 was new, it would go into that mode around every 800 miles, after 4 years, 60000 miles (FSSH and loads of software updates regarding that issue) it would do it every 150 miles.
Don´t whatever you do turn the car off when its "cleaning". As soon as my CX-5 went into that mode i took the car for a drive, using manual gears (Higher revving, as the DPF needs heat) and let it do it´s thing for around 10 miles. Annoying; Yes, costly too. Even after doing it as written above (as my dealer told me to do) i had injectors replaced 3 times, turbo sensors twice and the intake manifold was cleaned 3 times, by shot blasting with walnut shells. Over 5k in repairs, although it was all on warranty even after the warranty ran out..... As its a "known problem"

 

Whta was your daily distances? How many km per trip? It wasn't warranty repairs?

 

I have owned a Jaguar XF and XJL and the Diesel Particulate Filter drove me nuts. Almost every week I got a “DPF Full“ message. To clear this by burning off excess particulates, I had to drive ten miles at speeds exceeding 50 MPH. Mazda has evidently found a solution that doesn’t require high speed driving. Strangely, I didn’t have the same problem with my Mercedes, but I have an outstanding claim with MyDiesel.com with all three vehicles and expect the Mercedes claim to be the most likely to succeed. Volkswagen has already admitted emission misdemeanors. You possibly don’t get DPF and hence injector problems if emissions exceed those reported due to technology cheats.

I agree with Brianthemodeller and Lee, this is a common problem and a high capacity diesel engine isn’t ideal if you are doing largely short trips because the DPF won’t “burn off” the particulates. Diesel is unsuitable for stop start urban locations and that is why it is discouraged.

 

I have owned a Jaguar XF and XJL and the Diesel Particulate Filter drove me nuts. Almost every week I got a “DPF Full“ message. To clear this by burning off excess particulates, I had to drive ten miles at speeds exceeding 50 MPH. Mazda has evidently found a solution that doesn’t require high speed driving. Strangely, I didn’t have the same problem with my Mercedes, but I have and outstanding claim with MyDiesel.com with all three vehicles and expect the Mercedes claim to be the most likely to succeed.

I agree with Brianthemodeller and Lee, this is a common problem and a high capacity diesel engine isn’t ideal if you are doing largely short trips because the DPF won’t “burn off” the particulates. Diesel is unsuitable for stop start urban locations and that is why it is discouraged.

Again, I have not found Diesels to be a problem for me, but admittedly this was solely Audi diesels. Never a single issue, and had three of them, all doing short journeys in the week and then large ones at the weekend.

The Audi would do a DPF regen at about 30 minutes into a motorway drive if it needed it, so I did this every 2-3 weeks if it hadnt had a run , and all was well.

This seems to be 'injector cleaning', DPF regens in the Mazda from what I have seen is very loud.

Unless I can find a way to manage this, I think I am getting to the point of being done with Mazda, with the disastrous PHEV to this.

It makes no sense this happened after a weekend of purely motorway miles, I could understand it if like the first time it had done it after a couple of weeks of short journeys.

There is also 'iStop' which cuts the engine out when stopped and coasting, so I can't even get the engine warm sometimes without turning that off. At the same the time as turning Autohold on and turning Lane Assist off, correcting the DPS when it gets it wrong, watching out that the emergency brake isn't going to try and kill me when backing out of the driveway..What a massive polava just to go for a drive.

 

That's why I like my current RAV4 hybrid, I get in and go.

 

Boy do I miss my previous Audi diesel for the same thing!

 

On the screen there is no information not to turn off the engine. Have you check it in User Manual for CX60?

 

No nothing on screen, and nothing in the manual about it at all - not that I can find using search words like 'idle' or 'fast'

https://instructions.cdn.mazda.media/media/mazda/7791d_CX-60_8KX1-EE-22D_R_Edition1_web.pdf?fbclid=IwAR2Mea-4_N99kHx3yCL0BNhrt2DKO7VmQxFJdfNdF-5QmKeZgTcMcNUedWY#page=691

 

Maybe Mazda wants to avoid this fu***' nightmare happens...: "youtube.com/watch?v=eBoZsZACh5E".

 

A 140,000 mile car without any running problems according to the presenters.

All engines suffer coke build up, even petrols. But if you run a Diesel every day for ten years on 1-2 mile trips, that will surely happen, you have to look after a diesel, but being a (semi) responsible adult and car owner, I know what to do, and don't need to wake my neighbours up for the car to do it.

So happy for this system to exist, but allow me the right to turn it off!

 

Why the injectors have to be cleaned at short distances? I thought that the problem is only with DPF.

 

Exactly..

 

It’s due to the use of new multi phase injectors for power increase. “Because the special injectors can get condensation inside them if the engine is started for short periods, it will go into a self flushing mode where it purges the fuel in the injectors with a fast idle. It is completely cancelled when a gear is selected so it doesn*t pull at the car but it does get questioned when owners see the message “Fast idle due to dirsel injector cleaning”.”

 

Thanks Mazda for that 'great' engineering! Its certainly going to get questioned when your running at 1500rpm on your driveway.

It barely does 1500rpm on the motorway at 70mph...shows you have much load it is using and the noise level.

 

Had you got more cleaning procedures last days?

 

Have you got more cleaning procedures last days?

No, not since the last one...I just turned the engine off as normal and it cleared itself the next drive.

 

Clearly you have not owned a modern diesel engine before as all have DPF Regen., its not a curse.
I never recommend any car buyer of any brand buy diesel if you travel less than 30 mins a day. Diesels are long haul not for short drive soccer mum usage.
Most car reviewers love diesels but they dont own them.
Fastest way to kill any common rail diesel engine is short driving, even with annoying curse.

 

Fast Idle Cleaning has nothing to do with DPF Regeneration.If you had bothered reading the thread, FIC is a Mazda specific trait regarding the cleaning of their ‘special injectors’ . I’ll upload a Mazda doc shortly explaining, its a little more involved that what it states but its due to the design of the injectors and chambers that Mazda felt that high velocity cleaning is required .

Diesels definitely can be used for short trips as well as long hauls, provided they are looked after correctly, in ten years of Central London diesel ownerships I’ve never had a single problem and they perform great for the job they do.

My maintenance solution is to always ensure at least once a week to ten ten days that a good thirty minute plus motorway drive is performed to clear the DPF. Without doing this, and running five minute daily errand runs, yes you could run into issues.

 

Never had a single issue around cleaning on my Tiguan diesel in 78k miles.

Perhaps the Tiguan isn't as fancy as the CX60 in the way it manages the engine 😀

 

No what I said about fast idle has everything to do with DPF.

You uploaded a 2019 document from MNAO related to the old CX-5 Diesel sold very briefly in USA also used with mandatory Adblue for emissions and injector clean.
This KF CX-5 was the first ever diesel Mazda car sold in USA.

It is not the same as CX-60 or CX-90 diesels as they are Not the same engine design or same parts of Bosch brand.
None of the engine parts are common with what is now considered old new diesel in that KF CX-5 which had Adblue set up to pass US emissions, car engine and car was discontinued in less than 6 months.

Currently there are no new gen diesel engines in CX-90 on offer and I doubt there will be for North America.

This what happens when people post random information which is not related to your car.

And yes, short distance driving of any diesel engine will result in short engine life as one of the first signs are IC warning lamps and or 'oil level rising' (look at dip stick) in sump due to raw unburnt diesel fuel wash past piston rings what mixes with engine oil in sump and or lack of DPF Regen or both.

Personally I would never own any diesel car or truck of any brand unless you do long haul driving...they are fantastic then, otherwise way too much grief.

 

This thread is about Fast Idle Cleaning, which is a process explained above, nothing directly related to the DPF, the CX60 has its own DPF regeneration functions which are different to the FIC cleaning process. If you were an owner of one you would know this as the DPF regen is fairly audible when its happening and its at different intervals than the FIC. Sure, everything on an engine is connected in some way, but fundamentally these are different functions for different first tier solution purposes.

The FIC is relevant to all Mazda Diesels that have the Fast Idle Cleaning process (in the UK and Europe at least), which is all of them I am told by Mazda. I have had big discussions about this process with the increasing emissions controls in the UK and 'idling' engines being forbidden in some boroughs in London. The only reason i used this document as it was one that explained the process the best.

The FIC process is the same for the CX60 3.3 as as the Mazda 2.2 Diesel, the 3.3 has Ad-Blue, (I imagine the 2.2 does also depending on age) it doesn't really matter about the age of the document at all or what vehicle it refers, the process and its function is still the same as it still exists.

Diesels are great, and the Inline6 is an absolute peach, works fine for short journeys as long as you are aware it needs a blast every week or so. Thankfully my FIC barely comes on anymore, it seemed to only happen when it was new but it may be because of the document, I now know to not turn it off multiple times in fairly quick succession before it has gotten to operating temperature, but even still I do do this sometimes and its been fine.

As I said, 10 years and counting and the diesel car that did most of those daily short trips now lives a few doors down and is carrying on fine..doing short trips. We can create shock headlines for most things, such as driving a petrol engine hard from cold will score the bores and potentially lead to a ring being pulled, (wonder how the PHEV manages this when the EV mode switches to a freezing cold ICE at 60mph?) no engine is infallible and will be affected by whatever use it is given, but authoritarianism is so, 1940..

 

With my Diesel cx60 apart from the noise and fast idle I also get a real smell of burning rubber, just wondering if anyone else experiences this also.

 

@Southeastern are you able to switch to D and drive off while the fast idle is happening?
Edit: just noticed that you're able to drive

This is making me question my decision to buy the CX60 diesel. I don't like the PHEV either.

 

@Southeastern are you able to switch to D and drive off while the fast idle is happening?
Edit: just noticed that you're able to drive

This is making me question my decision to buy the CX60 diesel. I don't like the PHEV either.

Yes you are, the negative side to it is that when you become stationary again, such as at the traffic lights, the cleaning mode continues so all the people around you look at you like you're an idiot revving your engine at the lights - which being s diesel is quite noisy.

Tbf, now my engine has gotten older, the FIC mode dosent activate as much, it seems to happen if you stop and start it around 4 times within 20-30 minutes, or multiple short trips in one day.

 

The CX60 curse just keeps on giving.

After a couple of weeks, this happened. The engine goes to 1500rpm at tickover and then holds it for however long it decides it needs to do its thing.

View attachment 307

As this happened after a couple of weeks of short trips as due to illness I hadnt done my usual DPF preventative measure of a 30-45minute rag up the motorway, I figured it was just a safety measure, and after around 5 minutes it went off. Its not a good thing, the engine is pining away at 1500rpm, and it isn't quiet. My neighbours were getting pissed, but if its once in a blue moon I could cope.

According to Mazda, you should not turn off the engine during this process, so if it happens at 2am, well, yes, you'll look like a proper bellend revving your cars engine.

I read this document, sure its for the 2.2D engine, but I imagine it is the same principles.

https://static.nhtsa.gov/odi/tsbs/2019/MC-10163331-0001.pdf?fbclid=IwAR3fgN86C7TSet-7XLN3-DiH4iJjGAeRZA_w4oClG-xtYFzdzfLhOr4EfCY

Page 9

View attachment 306

After a weekend of mainly motorway and long A-road driving, if happened again. This time taking 10 minutes to go off.

So, it made little sense, as I had not done any short trips and this was the first time I had fired up since then.

If this is going to become a thing, that I can't even go to the shops without having to leave the car revving away in either the carpark or my driveway, then this is a serious flaw.

I have used Super Diesel in this tank, so when its empty, Ill put the standard stuff in - but I felt the Super would have been the better option to keep the engine and injectors clear when doing shorter trips.

If anyone has any experience of this, would love to hear your thoughts!

hi
Prior to the 10k service our would do the burn off approx every 3 to 4 weeks but since the service it now does it every 2 to 4 short trips
Whilst getting other faults fixed I told them of this problem but they said it’s normal.
Mazda changes their mind when they NEED to

 

It’s the dealers that make stuff up, my dealer said this was a DPF regeneration programme, they literally don’t care and have no clue 🤦‍♂️